Dialogue — A Way of Transcending Otherness
“Well, you don’t sit in your room somewhere and dispel illusions — very few people are capable of doing that. I mean, some people are capable of doing it, but most aren’t. Usually you find out what you think by interaction with people, otherwise you don’t know what you think — you just hear something,and maybe you accept it,or you don’t pay any attention to it, or something like that. You learn about things because you’re interested in the topic, and when its the social world, your interest in it often involves — ought to involve, at least — trying to change it, it’s in that context that you learn. And you learn by trying out ideas, and hearing reactions to them, and hearing what other people have to say about the topic, and formulating programs, and trying to pursue them, and seeing where they break down, and getting some experience, and so on and so forth.
So dispelling the illusions is just a part of organizing and acting. It’s not something that you do in a seminar, or in your living room-not that you can’t do it there, but it’s just a different kind of activity. Like, if you have some illusions about classical Greece, let’s say then you can probably do it in the library, to some extent at least. But if you’re trying to dispel illusions about a live, ongoing social process that’s changing all the time, and that you only get to see little pieces of-that’s really not the way to do it. You do it through interactions with other people, and functioning in some kind of community of concern, and of commitment, and of activism.”
— Noam Chomsky
I just spent a few days exploring the wild Sierra Nevada and was constantly confronted by such beauty and wholeness. In these mountains is the reminder that life and death are one, there are no divisions, all are connected in one amazing web — myself included, and the truth is not stagnant. As I would stand upon the living earth and gaze into the knife-like peaks splintering the sky, i was aware of how change flowed in diversified oneness and order. It was glorious chaos/order, not disorder, but an immeasurable presence that could not be contained by thought and that, in its essence, is unknowable. Seeing the world in this way, how can I not love, how can i not see all of life as part of myself, and how could I be afraid of others in any way?
“An awake heart is like a sky that pours light.”
— Hafiz
Overall, our cultural ideology is blind to wholeness and interconnectivity, and as we are taught a dualistic way of thinking, many of us struggle in seeing our part in this grand symphonic flow. Instead of seeing that we are participants in this ecological wholeness, our culture instead believes and teaches us that we are separate from nature and each other. Consequently, we have people who are buried in grief and isolation, searching for some sense of empowerment and control outside of themselves. Because of this separatist ideology that formulates fear and ignorance, all the issues we see today are conceived and connected. Consequently, there are grave consequences that are the result of our culture’s thought process.
Violence is normalized, and the wild is being destroyed. Our culture tries to mentally enslave us into its ideology from the time when we were children limiting our voice, limiting our risk-taking, and pushing conformity and suppression of thoughts and feelings, making us compete against one another while limiting our ability and to open into our innate wonder while going through the schooling process. This shuts out our openness to all of life and forces us into our culture’s narrative, solidified belief systems that teach us that we are separate and essentially at war with the world. Once something is so conditioned into us, it is hard to change and voice what is wrong within the very structure of society. Even our language is solidifying in nouns creating the idea and perception of basic materialism and dualistic reality.
“We’re not destroying the world because we’re clumsy. We’re destroying the world because we are, in a very literal and deliberate way, at war with it…. Given a story to enact that puts them at odds with the world, as yours does, they will live at odds with the world.”
— Daniel Quinn
Yet, somewhere deep inside ourselves, most of us recognize that something is off; something is just not right. But, once that uncertainty arises, we find ways to push this anxiety back down, for what would we do with that discomfort anyway? We use religion, sports, video games, shopping, drugs, alcohol, politics, our work, etc., to either fight against, run away from or numb ourselves from the belief that we are separate and thereby continue in our dysfunctional patterns.
Yet, our blindness does not go unchecked. We are viscerally seeing that our society’s actions are deeply wounding the planet. For example, a 10-year drought spurred on by climate change has no end in sight, gravely impacting these wondrous, seemingly ageless Sierra Nevada ecosystems. Climate change is not only impacting the native flora and fauna but also is quickly melting away the glaciers with its relentless heat, which just a short time ago were found throughout these mountains. These glaciers had consistently fed fresh mineral-laden waters into streams and rivers, eventually flowing into the valleys and the heavily populated Los Angeles basin. Now, Southern California is having to deal with the reality of water shortages. This is just one illustration of the interconnectivity of nature and ourselves and what happens when we don’t think about how our collective actions are not disjointed but actually interconnected with all of life.
If we take a step back and observe all the conflicts that rage politically, individually, socially, and environmentally, we may have a sense that all of these issues are born out of our culture’s ideology of separateness. This separateness also creates a deep feeling of isolation, despair, and loneliness, pushing people to escape in various ways, including belief and certainty.
“A mind that is self-concerned with its own ambitions, greed, fears, guilt, suffering has no capacity to love. A mind that is divided in itself, that lives in fragments, obviously cannot love. Division implies sorrow; it is the root cause of sorrow — division between ‘you’ and ‘me’, ‘we’ and ‘they’, the black, the white, the brown and so on. So wherever there is division, fragmentation, love cannot be, because goodness is a state of non-division. The world itself is indivisible.”
— Jiddu Krishnamurti
All around our society, people argue and challenge locked into solidified beliefs and a certainty of the right to make themselves feel solid and safe. We also see that there are immeasurable amounts of knowledge that we can dive into, thinking that maybe that could help solve our problems or build our sense of self into something greater and more knowing. However, it seems to really not matter as our society continues to spiral into deeper and deeper maelstroms of sorrow. In fact, this superficial idea of safety and security is an illusion as these belief systems put barriers and programs that perpetuate division and violence towards others with different perspectives. We see this in our families, in our schools, in our workplaces, and in the world at large. In ignorance, so many people within the construct of our culture hold on to dogmatism and beliefs and won’t look to change or see another view. This dogmatism which is craving power and strength through belief is built from fear and isolation and perpetuates the belief that we are separate. This does not need to be the case.
When society is divided and stuck, what can we do?
Waking up begins with not only oneself questioning but in also seeing that we are all in this together, whether we like it or not. Waking up is both individual and communal. It has to be both, for in waking up is an openness to others and a vulnerability to breaking down the ego walls of isolation. In so doing, it is not just oneself waking up but seeing that as we are part of a community. By that very link, our community is also waking up as we are.
How our society exists is through isolation. If only one person decides to wake up, and the community does not, then the culture is not really changed. If we continue down a road of dogmatism, unquestioning beliefs, and certainty, we will simply perpetuate the cultural conditioning.
However, questioning and listening with an open and flexible mind and then being open to each other and the ideas that are presented gives a possibility for change and the ending of ignorance, and the possible transformation into what is inherent in all of us, wholeness. In wholeness, we see we are not alone but are all deeply connected and participators of wholeness.
“What is in you, you take to be outside you and what is outside, you take to be in you. The mind and feelings are external, but you take them to be intimate. You believe the world to be objective, while it is entirely a projection of your psyche. That is the basic confusion and no new explosion will set it right! You have to think yourself out of it. There is no other way….The consciousness in you and the consciousness in me, apparently two, really one, seek unity and that is love.”
— Nisargadatta Maharaj
Dialogue is a way to begin bridging the divide we feel and sense in our society. Let's unite to discover our unity rather than seek more division. By coming together and talking about our concerns, issues, or anything for that matter, with openness and curiosity, and without judgment, we may discover something occurring within the group that was unexpected and gives rise to new insights. We also may begin to have true communion with each other and actually see into one another mutually and unconditioned. Dialogue dismisses our conditioned isolating thoughts without trying and moves us out of our own myopic monologues into a sharing that is communal and egalitarian.
“The trick is not to be isolated-if you’re isolated, like Winston Smith in 1984, then sooner or later you’re going to break, as he finally broke. That was the point of Orwell’s story. In fact, the whole tradition of popular control has been exactly that: to keep people isolated, because if you can keep them isolated enough, you can get them to believe anything. But when people get together, all sorts of things are possible.”
— Noam Chomsky
Dialogue is the opportunity to be fully seen and to see others fully. It is an opportunity to share in trust and openness. Dialogue gives the opportunity to see oneself within the mirror of the conversation. One begins to notice what is arising within without needing to react. Dialogue teaches us how to listen without personalizing or looking for the next thing to say.
We are individuals, yes, which means that we are truly undivided at our roots. We do not need not be isolated. In fact, we are inherently connected with each other. Isolation is an illusion. We need to open up to each other and the wild nature that flows around us. Dialogue can be a springboard in which we can come together and practice looking at and letting go of our beliefs. Only with the flexibility and openness of mind can we create a different way of living together. Dialogue can provide the opportunity to move in that directionless place of presence.
“The problem with the world is that the intelligent people are full of doubts, while the stupid ones are full of confidence.”
— Charles Bukowski
Being full of doubt means one is open. Openness is what intelligence is. Intelligence is open to anyone. Everyone can live in intelligence. And anyone can also live in what Bukowski terms stupidity or what I would call ignorance. Ignorance means shutting out and ignoring what lies right before us. Closed off, in fear, stuck in beliefs, one encloses oneself in ignorance, thereby shutting out wonder and intelligence. Dialogue opens us back up into intelligence.
A wonder i have is this…. In this way, do schools help blossom intelligence or ignorance? If it is ignorance, how can we bring in intelligence? Where does that begin? I wonder what would happen if we let our children lead with their wonder and curiosity and let learning be spontaneous and alive with no reward or punishment, such as grades and small class sizes; what would happen to each child’s growth? What would happen if the classrooms engaged in dialogue and learned from each other in-depth and openly? I wonder if students spent a great deal of their days, if possible, in their local ecosystems in quiet, listening to the myriad species that interweave with us? I wonder what would happen if we slowed down to really look, participate in, and let learning happen at its own pace for each child and group of children? Would this begin to transform our culture from isolation and fragmentation to interconnection, community, and wholeness? What do you think?
